Hey P&Sians,

Hoping your respective worlds are most awesome.

So after almost two years of building puppets, I finally decided to tackle sculpting a face. Aargh! I certainly need some pointers before tackling this again. So if you could indulge me...

How do you ensure symmetry? Do you have a method that ensures this? Do you start with a minimal base and add pieces as you go or solely take away from a block?

What tools do you you use? My humble steak knife just didn't cut it (pardon the pun).

Draping over a sculpted surface was uber tricky and resulted in far more darts and seams than I'm comfortable with. Is there a trick to minimising these? Stretching any further just wasn't an option. Fortunately the puppets clothes hide the bulk of them but there's a mean looking seam running down his chin that I just can't hide any further.

When working with fleece (Antron isn't available here) what's the best way to hide your stitches? I did the old ladder method but again, it's really obvious. I don't mind visible stitching round the mouth as to me it gives an appearance of gummy teeth which I like but again, that damn chin seam is soooo obvious!

It occurs to me after this guy that I appear to be totally incapable of making a smaller styled puppet. Idea of size below. Whilst all my misfits are big (some huge) they are very lightweight. Would size be a deterrent to most performers? Most people seem to make puppets similar in size to the Project Puppet patterns. Is there some sort of industry standard?

For the Aussies, can you recommend a distributor of arm rods on the cheap? I can't find piano wire and the dowel or revamped coat hangers just looks dodgy.

Lastly, and on a totally different tangent, the Expo I enter every year is coming up and I want to make some smaller objects cheaply for the kids and for quick sales. Last year I did full bodied finger puppets but I wanted to do something different. Can anyone give me some pointers on developing a pattern for a glove puppet? I'd like to steer away from the 'Sooty' styled puppet but am unsure if there are really many other options for a puppet this size.

Thanks for you help guys. My attempts at sculpting below:

Damn chin seam...

Thanks guys

Lizzie

There's only one person i know who sells arm rods and that would be Adelaide Puppets (also known as As We Grow Learning Toys). Outside of that you would have to order from overseas I think. I dont know where to buy piano wire, but it's possible if you ask around Unima Aus someone could point you towards it.

Nice job Lizzie.

On the Music Wire have you tried hobby stores like RevMax? I find my Piano Wire at hobby stores as they use the steel cable for control rods, and other stuff.

Hi John. We don't really have anything like that around and to be honest, there may be a substitute out there but given I don't know what it looks/feels like, I haven't really got a comparison. It seems to be the preferred option here but like so many other resources I learn of through the forum, I just can't seem to source it or it goes by another totally random name. To this day I don't think I'm using the correct foam - even after reading Na's guide and explaining my needs to the foam guys, they just look at me oddly!

Hi John. We don't really have anything like that around and to be honest, there may be a substitute out there but given I don't know what it looks/feels like, I haven't really got a comparison. It seems to be the preferred option here but like so many other resources I learn of through the forum, I just can't seem to source it or it goes by another totally random name. To this day I don't think I'm using the correct foam - even after reading Na's guide and explaining my needs to the foam guys, they just look at me oddly!

I've found that what we read on puppet websites and forums is 'incorrect' - the terms used tend to be Americanisms, and not understood by people here. ... Actually I can remember going to the American puppetry festival and asking for "reticulated foam" in the puppet shop - they didn't know what I was talking about. It's quite likely that whatever sources I have read have made up their own terms as well, or use ones not commonly known.

There's a thread somewhere here on foam and what the various types are. Go read it, because it has a lot of good tips, like 'use the terms that the supplier uses'.

'Correct foam' is a bit of a misleading phrase anyway - whatever works for you is fine. You don't have to use what everybody else does, especially when we don't get the same products here as Americans do. (What exactly are you referring to? I might have another suggestion)

I have thought about going to Bunnings and asking around for piano wire but never bother with it. You have to remember that any of these specialist items are going to cost way more than you'd want to probably.

Also John: hobby shops here are really quite hard to find, you're more likely to bump into a renovation/building shop than a hobby shop. Those hobby stores when you find them are extremely under-stocked with building materials, but instead tend to carry kits and large parts; whatever they do have that you need is in short amounts for large prices. In my experience, whatever time/energy/money you spend on hunting down the right place, the right product, at the right price, can be better spent on other things.

I have to agree kind of with Na. It may be that terms are not so much incorrect as localized.  For instance when I spoke with my foam supplier they where not really familiar with the term reticulated foam but when I explained to them that it was an open cell foam kind like you see used as a filter in things they understood what I was looking for. Same thing with the EVA foam. That is what they call it but when I use it here others have a hard time finding it, but if they explain that it is a very closed cell foam that is kind of like a rubber mat that often boating cushions are made of it helps them find it. EVA is also what they use for the fun, funky or craft foam that you do find in craft stores that comes in sheets and often is next to the felt squares.

So same thing with piano wire. Another name used is spring wire and most likely a better term to use. The trick is to understand why we like to use it. Have a look at the wiki definitions. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spring_steel http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_wire  The first has more technical data that could help you out maybe.  The properties of this wire are that it is hard to bend so it bounces or springs back to it's original shape.

Decided to break my replies into subject matter.

So looking at the picture I see a couple things about the dart on the chin. First if you are like me the small pucker at the tip of the dart may bother you a bit more then the seam itself. Often this is because the dart did not go quite far enough. Now that it is there you may be able to hand stitch from the outside and increase the length of the dart, but what might also pull the pucker out is to stretch the seam down to the bottom of the chin a bit more. This might not take all of that pucker out, but then maybe the resulting pucker may look more like a dimple in the chin. In fact if you could get in under the fabric and figure out where the pucker lands you might be able to put a small hole in the foam and then fill with glue and push some of the pucker into it to enhance the look of a dimple. Got lemons, make lemonade.

Now position of a dart. Since I really can't see all the angles on you chin from the pictures I am not sure this is valid or not but it may be that instead of being down the center of the chin the darts could have been on the sides of the chin. So You would lay your fabric flat along the curve of the front of the chin and kind of pin it at lip and bottom so it lays flat. Then see where you can take darts on the side of the chin. Granted you end up with perhaps two or more darts on the side but they may be less noticeable.

I personally prefer to machine sew darts in. My hand sewing is ok but still I get a bit uneven in my stitches. A machine stitch for me just looks cleaner. Don't forget that even regular fleece can be picked out a bit on the seam just like Antron. It does not have quite as much pile as Antron but still there is normally some.

If the pucker at the lip is not wanted, then wrap and pull the face fleece further into the mouth. When you do this you may have to cut a bunch of small darts in the edge so your face fabric lays flat.  Now place the black mouth fabric on top of this so it is about a good 1/4 to 1/2 inch back from the edge and stitch or glue in. I do prefer stitching as a rule but in this case often I glue in the mouth fabric if it has a clean edge i.e. if it is felt.

Draping takes time. When I get in a hurry I don't get as clean a look. The longer I work at it and perhaps even start again and change location of darts the better results I get. Of course if you can find a fabric with all way stretch you are a step ahead of the game. Even stretch fabrics only have a one way stretch to them.  A lot of folks do not realize that although I have an idea you do because of your past work.

I personally prefer an additive approach as opposed to a reductive approach when it comes to sculpting.  In other words I start with a base then add to it. That is how I learned to sculpt in the beginning when I was making marionettes so that is how my mind works. This makes it easier for me to get symmetry, because I can can cut two piece the exact same shape and glue them on. That being said I see no problem with symmetry on your puppet and don't forget our own faces are not symmetrical.  

Knives, scissors, exacto knife, electric carving knife, Dremal sanding heads.  These are all tools I've used for cutting or carving foam. A serrated knife seems to work best on big cuts but to get down and really refine you need those scissors (small clippers the best) to clip away at the foam. The Dremal with a sanding head works pretty good but you have to be very careful. The drum is moving so fast that it can catch your foam and throw it across the room, normally resulting in a big ugly gash in the foam.  A lower speed seems to work best and just lightly touch the foam and be patient.

A lot of folks use sculpting calipers to achieve symmetry.  I never really got the hang of them but which is I guess why I never really got good at reductive sculpting.

I think this last one is not a bad size at all. Really a larger puppet is better for stage then a smaller one and the size this one is seems to be about the size we always used on stage. It really does depend on the venues you are working. I know you don't preform.

You say you want to try and build smaller puppets, well I suggest you go ahead and invest in a Project Puppet pattern. Choose the shape you like the best. The resulting sizes are pretty good for children.  While there patterns are different there are some basic commonalities about them that can help you down the line.  Having a pattern is going to let you consistently make a smaller puppet I think.  Even if you don't buy a Project Puppet pattern, then check out http://puppetvision.info/puppet-building-patterns (link is down at the moment). Andrew posted some of his patterns from the past. Pretty sure he had one of his head patterns posted.

I know Andrew has been doing some web design changes at the moment. Could be why the site is down.